Sam Sachdeva explains how to write a book about China

How difficult was it to get people to talk to you about China and its activities and influence?

I’ve been covering China’s ties with New Zealand for more than six years in my role at Newsroom, but even with that background, it was still a challenge to get some people to speak openly. A few contacts initially said they’d be happy to chat then suddenly went silent, and the Chinese embassy didn’t engage with me at all.

There does seem to be a real fear of offending the Chinese government and the retaliation that could result, which is itself pretty telling about the state of the relationship. But there were many more people who did talk to me candidly about their hopes and fears regarding China, and I’m hopeful my book can help encourage others to engage in an open discussion about a country we can’t afford to ignore.

New Zealand has in the past prided itself on a history of ‘‘firsts’’ with China – for example, we were the first Western country to back it joining the World Trade Organisation, and the first Western country to sign a free trade deal with it. We’re much more wary about jumping headfirst into such agreements these days, given the risks that come with being ‘‘a canary in the coalmine’’, as [academic] Anne-Marie Brady has put it.

The list of sensitive topics in the relationship is also growing by the day: from human rights abuses in Hong Kong, Xinjiang and mainland China, to its military manoeuvres in the South China Sea and the Taiwan Strait, and even its influence building in the Pacific.

We’re far from alone in this, so I don’t think Kiwis need to panic – but we do need to be aware of these underlying fault lines and what we need to do in response.

Where and how does NZ draw a line when working with overseas regimes – particularly if dealing with countries with human rights abuses on record?

Some politicians and business figures have said to me that if we only traded with countries who had a spotless human rights record, our list of partners would be non-existent. That’s a bit of a stretch, but I agree with the broader point – that we need to be able to work with nations on issues where we have a common interest, even if there are other topics where we have profound disagreements.

For example, we’ll never be able to tackle climate change properly if China doesn’t have a seat at the table. Having said that, New Zealanders do need to stand up for the values that we believe in as a country, and be willing to call out others who put those values at risk.

If we start pulling our punches on human rights issues for the sake of protecting our dairy exports, that starts to undermine what Aotearoa is all about.

Last week when Louisa Lim spoke of being racially abused, online, people doubted it – what does that say about New Zealand?

It’s appalling that anyone would face that sort of abuse in New Zealand, let alone a guest to our country, and I don’t understand why some people would choose to dream up some grand conspiracy rather than accept that we do have a problem with racism in some parts of our society.

That’s not to say that every Kiwi is racist, but it was only a few decades ago that newspapers and magazines were full of headlines about an ‘‘Asian invasion’’ following immigration changes. So we need to be very careful that we distinguish between the Chinese government and the Chinese community when we talk about the concerns we do have.

As Louisa herself says though, the CCP’s supporters do sometimes use allegations of racism to stop legitimate discussions about the country’s actions, and we shouldn’t fall into that trap.

To ask you one of your own questions, how viable is our independent foreign policy when global superpowers are pushing nations to pick sides?

I think we can maintain an independent foreign policy, but we just need to be clear about what that really means. Some people think of independence as meaning neutrality, that we should be a ‘‘Switzerland of the South Pacific’’. But taking an independent stance doesn’t mean we won’t work with other countries, just that we will decide when it is and isn’t in our own interests to do so. Is the pressure on us from the US and China going to go away? Not any time soon – but as long as we can be clear about what we stand for, and have confidence in our own values, we should be able to maintain that balance.